Matthew Mak 0:05

Do you ever know if the people doing the most aren't asking for advice? This is built without permission. I'm Matthew Back. Before you ever do a blueprint or standard business deal, a folding suit, hauling snow, and walking glasses until 2 a.m. Baking architecture, no trucks, and a build business from the ground up with my partner. No blueprint, no safety net, no approval. Just real stories, hard pivots, and what it actually takes to build something from nothing. Let's get to work. Oh, Mike. Thank you for joining on Build Wit All Permission. Time to get right down and dirty to the questions. Are you ready? Are you sweating? I'm ready. I'm ready, bro. Alrighty. You're standing and I'm sitting, so you must be ready. I'm ready. All right. So tell us, Mike. Double M. Double M. Okay. So, Mike, tell us, what's the one moment that made you realize you were done waiting for permission to start?

Michael Mok 1:08

Uh moment I was done waiting was when I got fired. Oh. When I got laid off, when I got laid off as like a one-person layoff from my biotech company. Wow. Okay. Yeah, that means that means you're fired. Okay. And how long ago was that? Oh, that was 20 21 years ago. Okay. Was that 21 years ago? Over 21 years ago. And I was in the middle of going to business school. I was really tired of the industry because I felt like I was just doing the same thing day in, day out. Yeah. And yeah, it was that was the moment. Like that it was actually really quite scary because it just feels like a scar to get fired.

Matthew Mak 2:01

But honestly, it was a great release. Yeah. So would you say like that feeling? Like I know obviously in the moment um when you're in it, it's a different feeling, right? But it's almost like if it wasn't for that, you know, you would not be kind of where you are today if it wasn't for that, right?

Michael Mok 2:19

Yeah, it was it was the weirdest thing because it was literally like there was an invisible hand, the hand of God, like in soccer terms.

Matthew Mak 2:31

Yeah.

Michael Mok 2:31

Where no matter how hard I tried to make things work at work, it just didn't work.

Matthew Mak 2:39

Yeah.

Michael Mok 2:40

Like we I would do these experiments, it's like I've done these experiments like thousands of times.

Matthew Mak 2:44

Yeah.

Michael Mok 2:45

And it just would just fail.

Matthew Mak 2:47

Yeah.

Michael Mok 2:48

Right? So it was just it was meant to be.

Matthew Mak 2:52

Yeah. Wow. Oh, awesome, man. And uh like so like tell us uh what's what's the sacrifice that uh that you made that most people they'll never see or talk about.

Michael Mok 3:06

Oh stable income. Stable income. Yeah, I think this is the thing that people don't talk about. They think, oh, it's so it's all so easy. You can do whatever you want anytime. Actually, that's quite the contrary. Yeah. That's actually the problem. You can do whatever you want anytime. But really the challenge is that you need to pick and choose where you focus your energy and efforts in on.

Matthew Mak 3:33

Yeah. And like they were were were you like like let's say trying to do multiple things when you were like trying to figure things out, or like you just uh were able to you know focus on that one thing and say, you know what, this is what I need to focus on.

Michael Mok 3:50

No, I actually went through different so I went through different different uh different iterations. Yeah, many different iterations to become who I am today. Yeah, I I actually worked before when I got into construction, I worked nine years for this Tile and Stone import company. So we were importing and exporting importing uh countertop material coming from China, yeah. And uh and at the same time I was managing the installation crews for about nine years. That's where I really cut my teeth. Um I really listened to my dad really well. He's like, Don't go work for Chinese people. I'm like, okay, I'll go work for Chinese people. Oh man, but uh it was great because I really learned actually, I learned a lot of customer service because I was the guy who was sent, yeah, I wasn't installing countertops, but I was the guy who was sent out to all the problems that showed up, yeah. Right, so deal with it. It was a firefighting job where you manage to calm down the the clients, the homeowners, and then also calm down the installers because the installers like, well, I'm doing it right, like what's wrong? Yeah, not right. So there's all this tension all the time, and it is um that was the greatest lesson. It's like how to manage the tension in the room with homeowners and construction teams. Yeah, and so that was that was yeah, that was part one, and then I went and did other things, yeah.

Matthew Mak 5:18

And that's giving you now the skills in what you're doing, able to more easily now manage being uh your uh is it GC or just home builder or I'm a general contractor residential uh in California in the San Francisco Bay Area specifically.

Michael Mok 5:36

Yeah, so that gave me the knowledge and learning how to manage different people and manage people's expectations, how to communicate with people. Uh, these are all things that you don't really learn. That you don't teach that it's not taught in school. You just of course best thing is baptism by fire.

Matthew Mak 5:53

I like that. Baptism by fire. Yeah, we not Buddhist. Oh yeah, fire, fire, yeah, like Street Fighter, right?

Michael Mok 6:03

Like Street Fighter, yeah, logo flame.

Matthew Mak 6:09

Oh man, we could go on and on about the uh accent all day wrong, dude. That's you, man. Is it me? I don't know, man. You pull it out of me somehow. Oh man, like how come your English so good?

Michael Mok 6:24

I don't know. Oh, geez. How the hell we get into this type of thing.

Matthew Mak 6:30

I don't know, man. I don't know. It's all good, though. It's all funny games. That's it. So somebody loses uh something, but I don't need to say it.

Michael Mok 6:37

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, uh I would say that uh dim sum in Toronto is way better than here.

Matthew Mak 6:43

Uh yeah, I've heard that. Absolutely. Welcome anytime. Welcome anytime. You know, yeah. Well, when you do, we'll go out, we'll go for some dim sum.

Michael Mok 6:53

Yeah, for all those people don't know, it's not dim sum, it's yum ta, baby.

Matthew Mak 6:57

Yum taw, Mike. Awesome. And um, that's really that's really cool. And you're right, like about the experiences and all, and like it's a lot of the things that um like we go through in our lives, right? That's where like that builds our character and builds our strength. Like, as much as like you know, going through it and stressful at the time, let's say when we're you know working for someone or for another company, and then you're dealing with all the stress that's thrown at you, but then it's just built you that much stronger. But in the time you're not thinking that you're just like constantly stressed. Now you're stressed on for yourself, not for someone else, in a way, right?

Michael Mok 7:34

Yeah, I mean, I I think my parents are freaking out. I mean, you know, you go, I I you go and get I mean immigrant kids, you have to get us you have to go to college, education, yeah. Education. So went undergrad, biochemistry, molecular biology, worked 10 years in the industry, and afterwards during that time I went to get an MBA, right? So you can't just have one degree, right? And then the thing that they showed up, it's like, well, wait, why are you working in construction? Like, construction is just full of roughnecks, yeah. And I was thinking, hmm, this is interesting. I kind of like it.

Matthew Mak 8:07

Yeah, yeah.

Michael Mok 8:08

I think I think there's a lot less uh can I say this on the pocket? There's a lot less corporate bullshit, right? Like you can say whatever you want for things are just like much generally, like in construction, things are either they're much more black and white. It's like yeah, there's no like nice typed up email, like oh yeah, no. Oh no, it's like if things are burning down, if there's a dumpster fire, like you know there's a or there's a kitchen fire, like you know right away, and people are just going haywire, right?

Matthew Mak 8:38

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, for sure. And then that's the differentiation in construction versus uh the corporates being behind the desk and the computer and just sending email messages back and forth, like they manage it by not the instance that you have to deal with it right away, they will deal with it when I get to it. Day, two, three, and you're like, you can't operate that way.

Michael Mok 8:59

Well, that's because in the space we operate in, we're working with homeowners, and homeowners like they may have a corporate job, but when it comes home, like the gloves come off. Like all the niceties that they do by corporate email, that most of that is gone. Yeah, so it's really it's really about managing, it's really about having a relationship with the family, right? Well, of course, and and also gaining and earning the trust that to be their advisor, yes, and guide them through the process of the build, which can be so turbulent, right? There's all these expectations like, oh, there's this, there's that, there's no, you know, I don't have running water, like the color of the paint is wrong, yeah, like all that.

Matthew Mak 9:49

And like one thing, like I know that it's not really spoken about a lot, even like out there on social, is that like there's there's a lot of cost involved in every action that you choose and and discuss and agree upon with your with your clients, right? Because like they're thinking now it's you know their money being spent, you're thinking now, okay, I got a budget for their budget and make sure that every decision that we're making is somewhat the right decision, even as far as the paint color, like you're saying, right? Because then if if it's the wrong paint color, it didn't come out the way that they wanted to, and they're asking to redo it, there's a cost involved, right? And time and labor and everything, right? So like it's it's just it just adds up very quick, right? Like for for um just as a comparison on what I go through uh is with the equipments on uh heavy machinery, where if a machine goes down and you got five laborers on the job site, like all hell breaks loose, right? Because now those guys are being you know paid, machines not working, and they feel like they can't do their job, and then it's costing everybody money.

Michael Mok 10:53

Yeah, that happened recently. We rented a dehumidifier, and the dehumidifier didn't work. Oh and we're like, dude, how's it gonna how are we gonna dry this place now?

Matthew Mak 11:04

Yeah.

Michael Mok 11:04

Oh yeah. Oh yeah, yeah. Just blow. Oh, yeah, good, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, uh we couldn't even get enough people to do that.

Matthew Mak 11:15

Yeah, I just do it just to get some laughter up because it's healthy, you know. That's what it is. It is healthy to laugh, yeah. Right, yeah.

Michael Mok 11:24

Maybe we we that's what we do in construction. We just make fun of each other all day.

Matthew Mak 11:30

Yeah, of course. That's what helps us get through the day, especially especially how stressful it gets, right, at times, right? And then it just eases off the stress. So yeah, exactly. So um a mic, and then what's uh a decision that changed everything? Uh the one that scared you the most at the time, let's say now that you're doing what you're doing is related to that. Like let's say you were you were doing something and then you got into this, just jumped out.

Michael Mok 12:01

I think the biggest I would say it wasn't the scariest the most. It was the it was a big pretty recently a big challenge, actually um breaking up with my business partner. Okay. That was um that was a doozy. Um it's the closest thing to having a divorce. Yeah. Like literally divorce everything, but really it was a great learning experience, and it it was meant to be in a sense where it was time for me to go take control of my own destiny in future, yeah. Right? And it wasn't happening already when I had a business partner because we didn't see eye to eye on things, right? We I wanted to do things a certain way, I wanted to build a team, I wanted to have a different corporate culture, and they were pretty old school about things. It's like, yeah, can we put like can we actually digitize like our project management platform? No, they're like, no, it's not necessary. We gotta keep it simple. Well, keep it simple means nobody knows what the F is where at this time at all, ever. And then people start blaming people, like, well, you should have done this, like no process in place. What do you do? Oh no, yeah, yeah. So it that was difficult because there was just so much fighting, and and then there's money issues involved, of course, right? So but I think it was just once again, it's part of the journey, right? And it's not God doesn't give you what you want, no, he gives you what's needed, and at the time it's like, look, this is what you want in the long run. So you just go and you just don't know it because you're like, oh, I just want you know, I just want massages all day, right? I want everything to be like, oh, go to this go to spa and like enjoy life, like like somebody hand over and like feed you mountain grapes in their mouth. Like, no, that's not life. But but in our minds, maybe we're gonna get there.

Matthew Mak 14:12

We'll get there. Yes.

Michael Mok 14:13

On our minds, that's what we want, right? Yes, we want it to be easy.

Matthew Mak 14:17

That's what, but then there's all the hard work and things put in put like you know, the dedication on all parties to get that goal together, to reach it together. It's just how to be more open-minded on achieving the same goal, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm sorry to hear that, man. That's it, and I know definitely it's not easy, right?

Michael Mok 14:37

Having no, it's not, I don't think there's there's nothing to be sorry about. Like, that's that was the way, that was the path. Yeah, right. Like, it's like what is that? What is that TV show? That is the way. Oh, it's Mandalorian.

Matthew Mak 14:52

Mandalorian. Oh, this is the way, yeah.

Michael Mok 14:54

This is the way, like, yeah, and that's the thing. It's like you read about it as an entrepreneur, like the obstacle is the way, like, friction is good, it's part of the problem. That's the thing, right? This is the way, so it's not like you gotta feel bad about it. It's I mean, my business partner, we're we're fine, like we get along. Yeah, it's not great, but you know, we're very cordial, and you know, we it's not like we just I don't hate 'em. Yeah, I know that that was a phase in life, and you you gotta love it for what it exactly was. Yeah, because it's there to elevate you to the next level.

Matthew Mak 15:30

Next level, yeah.

Michael Mok 15:31

The next level to find yourself, right? That's the thing. And I think a lot of times business owners reach conflict, or just people and reach conflict, and they don't they're like, oh, conflict bad. It's like, you know, the all these songs are like, Don't worry, be happy. I want life to be easy. Nah, that ain't that ain't the real world.

Matthew Mak 15:51

Yeah. Yeah, no, for sure. And it it's it's great that let's say that you like see that through that lens, right? And it's very hard when you're like in the moments of when things don't seem like they're working out the way you're wanting to, like it's during that time. That like now when you're out of it, you see it through that lens, right? And you understand it. Right. But the other party not saying that you know they're not a bad person, but they still may not see that same you know, same lens and understand that whole thing, right? No matter how much you explain it, right? Like there's this uh great um line that my partner and he's also my brother-in-law too, which is lots of fun and challenging for for both of us. Like we have our ups and downs, but we always communicate, make it work one way or another. And he always reminds me about uh Snoop Dogg where he says, you know, when you're leveling up, let's say you know, this is you and your your whoever is around you, your network, your friends, when you're leveling up, they have to close a gap, but you can't go backwards, you gotta keep going up. So whoever wants to come up with you, they gotta fill that gap, not the other way around.

Michael Mok 16:59

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Right. And the other quote that I really think is amazing is um Bruce Lee. Right? Bruce Lee says, be like water. What's his favorite drink? I don't know, water. What the dude. Man, well, you have to be set up. Sorry, I'm sorry. Yeah, your kids, your kids must be dying. Like, oh my they're like, Dad, again. Oh man, oh come on, Mike, you set me up, man. It's like every day since you have like hoppa kids, they're like Chinese Walha Hoppa. Oh you're like, go to school, go to Kumon.

Matthew Mak 17:43

Don't get me started about Kumon. Oh man, I'm uh I'm a I'm a I'm a byproduct and a victim. And a victim, me too. It's all in here. Sorry, but continue, Bruce Lee.

Michael Mok 17:56

Yeah, be like water, right? I mean, that's that's the that's the challenging part about being an entrepreneur because you really need to have that mental clarity like all the time.

Matthew Mak 18:06

Of course.

Michael Mok 18:07

Not like Zen, but like you just I mean, you just have to be in the presence, like in the moment.

Matthew Mak 18:13

Yeah. And then there's actually like this uh so this book. Um, so I don't know if you've met uh yet Luke Potter from from the group from the Elites group.

Michael Mok 18:22

Oh, he's he's fucking hilarious.

Matthew Mak 18:24

He is hilarious, and then so I saw his post on a book, and then I I got that book too, uh, The Gap in the Gain. Awesome book so far, just reading it through, and it and it's talking about how the pursuit of happiness, right? The American dream of pursuit of happiness.

Michael Mok 18:39

And see, you want to be American. I heard you say that.

Matthew Mak 18:42

Yeah, I do. I want to be American, yeah. Absolutely 100%, man. Well, I didn't want to be Canadian, I don't understand. Me neither. I fight polo bears up here. Uh so no, but it's it's interesting where it's like the mindset of that is that you know, you you can't run for your happiness, like you'll then you'll never be happy. You gotta be happy in the moment, like what you're saying, like it's in the moment, yeah. You gotta choose to be happy now, not strive for it. Because if you're gonna keep striving for your happiness, you're never gonna be happy.

Michael Mok 19:13

I I love uh that line that Dan Martell says, which is your mess is your mission.

Matthew Mak 19:19

Yes.

Michael Mok 19:20

Your mess is your purpose, right? And I think that is so so true. Like yeah, it's so powerful because whatever you feel pain with, that is your purpose and your reason.

Matthew Mak 19:31

Yeah. Oh yeah. Uh I got a big plate of mess.

Michael Mok 19:38

Oh yeah, when the you mean when the whole when the when the when your whatever fell on you.

Matthew Mak 19:43

Oh yeah, that was brutal. What the heck? Yeah, oh yeah, man. Crazy. And I'm walking, man. Right? I thank God every day. That's all I think.

Michael Mok 19:53

What fell on you?

Matthew Mak 19:55

Uh, you know these uh no no, it's uh walk walk behind Bobcat. Okay. Uh it's called the MT100. The things like a compact, you stand on the back of it, it can lift out. Oh, okay. It's like three feet, it can fit through the side yards and stuff. Yeah, that thing weighs, yeah, the mini ones, it weighs about 3,500 pounds, and just moving it. I just pivoted, and then the ground was not level properly, and just a simple thing, not like I don't know what I'm doing, and I just lost my balance. And when I lost my balance, the machine just fell right on top of me and it pinned me down, waist down. Dude, dude.

Michael Mok 20:29

I hate to say this, but like you just got reinforced. Asians can't drive.

Matthew Mak 20:34

Yeah, absolutely. That's why I try to tape them open while no part.

Michael Mok 20:45

Oh man, only all you know what, I didn't think it would go like this on this podcast. Like only you and I, man. Of course, but this is what makes it fun, no? No, we just need to be really serious. Like, how serious? Like you can't be serious, and don't be called Shirley.

Matthew Mak 21:06

Someone say Shirley? Shirley Temple. Shirley? Shirley? Yeah, Shirley. Yeah.

Michael Mok 21:10

Airplane? Airplane?

Matthew Mak 21:13

All right. Well, we're going off the rails here, Mike. Oh yeah. Uh so tell us what advice do most people you think get wrong when they're building a business or wanting to build a business from scratch?

Michael Mok 21:31

I think there's this perception it's always going to be easy. Right? And I I I say this because and I think it's harder and I was having this conversation with a fellow entrepreneur. I said, I think it's harder for kids who are really good students in school.

Matthew Mak 21:47

Yeah.

Michael Mok 21:48

Because they feel like that it's because they're so used to getting whatever the grade is, right? Getting the A, getting the A, and getting the A. And It's it's easier for like the guys who didn't do it so well in school. Oh, for sure. Because we're just like, I mean, look, I've been just frickin' beat up all day. Like I'll I'll give you an example. Um, my wife is the one of those people that will study 24 hours before and then ace the test. And I'm like, Yeah, I'm the opposite. I'll take like freaking four weeks, and then I get like a B plus. And I'm like, oh right, and and I think that's the thing, right? Like, I think the hardest part about being an entrepreneur is actually the psychological aspect of it.

Matthew Mak 22:36

Of course. That's the huge thing.

Michael Mok 22:37

That's the hardest thing. Yeah. Because you're gonna, it's a it's a freaking like roller coaster, ATV ride, like it's like, oh, I I hit a landmine. It's like, oh shit. Like it's yeah, every moment is like something's gonna come at you, right?

Matthew Mak 22:54

Yeah, yeah, and you just gotta be ready for it one way or another.

Michael Mok 22:57

And and I think that's the thing that the the the corporate world doesn't prepare you for, right? You're you're just like you're just like I'm walking down the street and it's like, whoa, left hook, right hook, right? And and then there's like a pothole at the same time.

Matthew Mak 23:12

Yeah.

Michael Mok 23:13

Yeah. And I think that's the biggest advice, right? It's just people are not mentally prepared for it.

Matthew Mak 23:20

Yeah, and then like kind of going back to what you said about the schooling system, it's like I feel that like the A students, the ones that strive in this in the curriculum, uh, it's and all of us that we're you know forced to kind of just to be robots in a way. You know, like we're being trained subconsciously to be sheep in a way. Right. And it just now looking at that, it's you're going through your studies, you're going through your school, you're to be whatever specific profession or career you want to get into. Right. No one teaches you to go out there and fight for yourself and be an entrepreneur. There's no there's no lessons for that right in school at all. Right. And that's why you see, like, and I'm I'm starting to see that most of the successful people of entrepreneurship are those like you're saying here, that you know, the the ones that are getting the B's, even the D's, even the ones that just get out of drop out of school, right? Because they figured out survival skills, they've uh figured out yeah, continue, yeah.

Michael Mok 24:23

Yeah, you were about this one. I I failed physics one quarter in college. Yeah, and here's the irony my dad's a physicist.

Matthew Mak 24:31

Oh perfect, man. That's it. He's so proud of you.

Michael Mok 24:37

You gotta come home, I'll cheater your ass. Yeah, and like that ain't happening anymore because you got me this, and like, yeah, actually, I got it for myself, but you know, it was it's always easier to believe my dad. Yeah, hey popped, you got me the F.

Matthew Mak 24:53

Well, that's good. I can at least share an experience so you won't feel you know as bad for that either. So, my high school, I failed English in grade 12. English could be a good one. Oh, I can I can tell. I can tell. Yeah, I can tell so good, right? So good. And I had to take summer school just to get that credit, just so that I could finish that past high school, and then apply like one month before just to get into gen arts, general arts and science, just so that I am still in school. It wasn't what I wanted to do in the beginning, but it was just to get in school, and then I had to work my butt off to get into architecture later, which was my goal all the time before what I was doing like now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So we all have our fun experience. It's okay.

Michael Mok 25:38

I can understand what you're saying. Because uh I'm we I'm using Google Translate, right? I don't like it.

Matthew Mak 25:43

Awesome. Okay, all right. So let's get to the what does built without permission mean to you personally?

Michael Mok 25:56

Built without permission means to me. You define your own path in life. Yeah, like whatever you're doing, right? Whatever your choice of life is, you're following your own path. Yeah, and that's really what it is.

Matthew Mak 26:15

Yeah, and you feel like it resonates with you as well, right? Like and I think that relates and that's what I love about that that line. I feel like it resonates a lot with all of us, a lot of people that we network with, a lot of people we meet, and where we are today is that it just it it defines each one of us.

Michael Mok 26:34

Yeah, it's it's not easy to do because I I think from an early age the education system it has its place. Right? We're taught to be very structured, and once people leave college, I think for even for myself, just felt lost. You're like, whoa, there's like no more guardrails. Yeah, what do I do? You don't know, and then you have to figure it out yourself. Yeah, but in reality, like life has always been that way. Yeah, it's just that you weren't we weren't aware of it. Yeah, or prepared or or prepared for it, mentally prepared for it. So I think that's really this is true for everybody, right? It's not just for entrepreneurs, it's true for everybody. You not everybody is meant to be an entrepreneur um or business owner, and I think there's nothing wrong with that, right? You can you can still be building without permission while you're working on a company, yeah, in a company, right? But as long as as long as everything is if that's every if as long as you feel like your personal you can say goals or your personal mission, your how you feel, if you're personally feeling fulfilled, yes, then you found your calling, right? I mean there's the reality is that's that's that's all that matters, is just finding your personal calling, whatever that calling is.

Matthew Mak 28:03

And I like that, and you and you're right, like uh to correct myself on that, I didn't mean it just specific to entrepreneurs, but in a way, just that yes, it's it's not everyone's meant to be an entrepreneur, and there's those that their um success to them is very different from yours, mine, and whatnot, and they're very content in the roles that they find, wherever it may be.

Michael Mok 28:25

Yeah, because because we at the end of the day, like at the end of the day, success is only defined what matters to you. Yeah, nobody else, of course. It doesn't matter, like it really doesn't matter.

Matthew Mak 28:36

Yeah, I care what you do.

Michael Mok 28:39

You don't give you don't care what I do.

Matthew Mak 28:43

Of course I do, because now we're connecting, we're brethrons. Dude, you gotta send me some dim sum. Dim sum. Hell yeah. Yeah, awesome, Mike. Awesome. Well, I really do appreciate you sharing the time and jumping on here with me. Uh, where can we find you, Michael?

Michael Mok 29:05

Oh, you can find me on IG at Michael J Mock. Uh, you can find me on LinkedIn, Michael J Mock, and you can find me on our website, CR Work at uh lcentralbuilders.com. And then we have another one that's coming. It's L Central Renew. That one's focused on um so one side is the remodeling side, and the other side is taking care of fixing leaks. We fix it like a detective and scientist, unlike the other guys who are just like barbarians of the gate, they just come in like, oh, you gotta leak. We just gotta rip everything out. And then all of a sudden, I mean, maybe somebody maybe your family member would love it, but it's like all of a sudden you just have a full kitchen remodel and you didn't even expect to do one. Yeah, not not what people want. So I mean, that's not what I want. That's why I don't sell that.

Matthew Mak 29:58

Yeah, and when you're seeing inspection, now all I just pictured is now for Halloween, you gotta dress up as Inspector Gadget.

Michael Mok 30:07

Dude, uh, yeah, go go gadget. Go go gadget.

Matthew Mak 30:11

Yes.

Michael Mok 30:12

Yeah, I I just need yeah, to be like I need my little niece to run everything for me, right? The ultimate delegation of like uh business owner, a business owner, just the full like visionary, and then like you've got Penny who's gonna be the full ops person. Yeah, this I mean go. I mean, Inspector Gadget has already got the full business plan. Like, there's the there's the visionary and there's the EOS operator that's taking it every and that was made by in the 90s, right?

Matthew Mak 30:44

Early 90s, dude.

Michael Mok 30:45

That is like that's hey, for entrepreneurs, that's EOS cartoon.

Matthew Mak 30:50

Just watch it, and you'll just learn how to do it. Now we gotta bring it back.

Michael Mok 30:56

Man, I love that cartoon. Good times, man.

Matthew Mak 31:00

Oh, yeah, good times, buddy. Good times.

Michael Mok 31:02

Oh, yeah, yeah. You like that Street Fighter movies coming out?

Matthew Mak 31:05

Oh, can't wait. Who would you be, Ken or Ryu? Neither. Don't tell me Chun Lee. Oh my god.

Michael Mok 31:18

Nope. Couldn't play her. I was I was actually more like uh Dalsum. Dulcim. Dalsom. I'll be Blanca. Dude, that sounds like constipation.

Matthew Mak 31:31

I love it. Raw, unedited, straight to the podcast.

Michael Mok 31:35

It's just really gonna be unedited. Oh my goodness.

Matthew Mak 31:38

No, no, it'll be edited. It'll be edited.

Michael Mok 31:42

These will be outtakes then.

Matthew Mak 31:43

Up I'm gonna ask them to make sure they put the bloopers, and then we'll be just for me and you'll be like, what what was the moment that you wanted to decide for yourself?

Michael Mok 31:54

And I'm like, dude, I got I gotta go to the bathroom right now. I'm deciding.

Matthew Mak 31:58

Like we're gonna do more calls together, man. This is awesome. Like more podcasts, more calls. Oh, we're gonna get right in there. You know, we're gonna have our own show too together.

Michael Mok 32:11

Yeah, it's the mock mock and mac.

Matthew Mak 32:14

Or is that the mac and mock. And the north and the south, they meet each other from the Toronto and the San Francisco, you know.

Michael Mok 32:21

East Coast, West Coast rivalry between like the polar bear. I don't know.

Matthew Mak 32:27

What do you uh Golden Gate Bridge?

Michael Mok 32:33

Yeah, I guess, yeah. Close, close, close. Yeah, we we can compare. We can do uh food tour. There you go.

Matthew Mak 32:42

Food tour. What hey, listen, people love food tours, man. They love it, they go crazy over it. That could be our our views and our followers. We're gonna start eating stuff and critiquing.

Michael Mok 32:53

You're like, oh, the dim sum in San Francisco tastes better than this this crap in Toronto.

Matthew Mak 33:00

Hey, it's gonna blow up. You might never know.

Michael Mok 33:03

The joke is like every every Canto, every Hong Kong Chinese person has a relative in Toronto. Of course they do. Yeah, and they all live in like Richmond Hill and Markham. See, you know it. You have it nailed. Yeah, because I've been there for a family wedding.

Matthew Mak 33:23

Awesome, awesome. Well, Mike, uh, let's stay connected, brother. Thank you for your time again. Enjoy your Friday. Okay, we'll be in touch.

Michael Mok 33:32

America's better than Canada. Blame Canada, blame Canada. Hey, I thought you do sound like Terrence and Philip, you know.

Matthew Mak 33:44

Yeah, I can pull it off pretty well.

Michael Mok 33:47

Yeah, I can see that.

Matthew Mak 33:49

Awesome, Mike. Well, have yourself a great weekend, man. We'll be in touch, man. Take care, man. Ciao, buddy. Later. Later. If you're waiting for permission, you're already behind. The life you're building starts with the decisions you make today. So stop thinking and start moving. Subscribe, share this with someone still thinking about it, and start building something of your own. No blueprint, no approval, no excuses. I'm Matthew Mack. This is built without permission.